Real Value Through Real Sponsorships

Episode transcript

Dan Beresh: Welcome back to Don't Lose the Point. This is the B2B marketing podcast where we talk to enterprise marketers about what's working, what's not, what strategies are out there in a hugely changing world, of B2B marketing. It's so important to be on top of it, and that's what we're here for with Don't Lose the Point.

Today, I'm really excited to talk about sponsorships. We've seen lots of sponsorships across enterprise B2B organizations, but I think no one is really doing it quite as innovatively as TCS. And today I have George Hutchings. He's the head of sponsorships for UK and Ireland for TCS. And George, what I'm really excited to dig into is this marathon sponsorship thing.

You have a huge portfolio of marathons, that when I look at it from, a, a, less educated perspective than you, I think, "Geez, this just looks like a, B2C kind of a thing." So it's a very interesting play and obviously has brought you a lot of success. So George, thanks very much for joining me.

George Hutchins: Yeah, thanks Dan. I appreciate the time, and it's great to unpack this with you. I'll probably start by saying that it's, not been something that's happened overnight. and it probably stems back to, a, a former CEO of TCS who identified a, a long-standing passion that he had, with running.

and that as a result has now transformed into a portfolio of around 14 marathons around the globe, where we are able to, fortunately bring some of our technology expertise to, to the experiences, the participants have a- across different countries. And, perhaps none more prominent than the TCS London Marathon, the TCS New York City Marathon, and, the TCS City Marathon being, three, of the, of the bigger, marathons that we engage with.

We have five of the eight, world marathon majors. And I guess our team's job is to shine a spotlight on, our clients, make them the heroes, and facilitate, an engaging process to, to getting them to the start line and, importantly getting, them to the finishing line. and it's a hugely exciting responsibility, that my team have, to bring that to life as a result of this sort of long-standing, this long-standing passion.

Dan Beresh: And, so I, I-- let's just-- I, I wanna unpack all this. It's so interesting. I want-- I, I so wanna talk about, the, the idea of running and the, boom and everything. But let's, just take it back again to the, beginning 'cause I'm really interested in this story. When I look at TCS, I think, "Oh, it's so smart they're sponsoring these running events."

Obviously, a lot of business folks at the running events. Tell me the story there. How did that happen? What was the decision initially to, "Okay, we're actually gonna put the whole weight of our company behind these events"?

George Hutchins: Yeah, and I-- listen, I don't think it, it, follows, a particularly, waking up one day and going, in the next 20 years, we're gonna have a f- a portfolio of this amount."

I think, by nature of, the opportunity that, access to all of these races, has provided, the, technol- the technological solutions that, you know, certainly what, we do, how that has helped the events improve, the events industry more broadly. and it started out slowly, I would say.

we, are-- we're fortunate enough to be, a more digital and technology partner with London Marathon events since 2016, and moved to title in '22. New York has a similar story, sort of 10-plus years. Amsterdam, TCS Amsterdam Marathon has a very similar story. It started off very much sort of region-specific, and that has grown to, okay, how do we, to your point earlier, how do we engage our clients?

How do we, provide an experience for them? how do we, yeah, help For the communities that we live and work, how do we make them more, healthier, fitter? obviously the topic of COVID that was just mentioned, a lot of the focus then shifted to, "Oh gosh, I need to get out the house.

I need to, keep our mind," th- the sort of s- similarities between b- the business environment with, resilience and, those sorts of things in the business world and, having that sort of resilience in a marathon space, the, the synergies were w- were actually quite a natural fit.

and obviously there's a lot of, jargon used to describe that. But actually, taking a step back, starting out just that, with that approach on, actually the, the commonalities between, what you do day to day, Monday to Friday, and, building that business resilience, finding the time, self-discipline, all that sort of stuff, a- and achieving a marathon.

And, as you said, as a runner-

Dan Beresh: Huge. Yeah ...

George Hutchins: that, that's probably a little bit of-

Dan Beresh: Well- ...

George Hutchins: a little crossover there.

Dan Beresh: Absolutely there is. And, w- what I love about this beginning of the story is it's really about genuinely sponsoring the events to not just drive it from a marketing, from a sales perspective, but actually getting out there and doing something that, does benefit people, does benefit the world.

And to your point, especially post-pandemic, in a, world where we, I think we all know we need to be more resilient, it, it speaks to just doing good. And, I think it's so interesting that's, so important for you folks because we always talk about values and how people wanna, you know- work with a company that, that has alignment on, shared values. And yet- Yeah ... we look at sponsorships in general, and I think we probably both agree they don't always do that, right? Sometimes the sponsorship is very obviously- Yeah ... purely monetary, pure brand play, pure let me put my logo on this- Yeah

this or that. So it's so interesting, and I just wanna unpack that for a minute. So to what extent do you think-- folks listening to this podcast are gonna be B2B marketers, who are thinking about, "All right, how do I, think about what, what sponsorship should look like in my organization?"

And so what advice would you have for those people, just in terms of making sure that what you're sponsoring is also fundamentally a part of your organization and doesn't just feel like a sort of a tack on for the sake of a logo placement?

George Hutchins: Yeah, it's a great question, and that, that question comes up actually everywhere really, because, you can, especially nowadays, you can be, can get caught out by just wanting to put a logo and, try and increase the brand aware- the awareness of, your partnership.

but, I think, with, genuine desire to, want to do, better with the community that you're, you may have offices, tapping into like-minded individuals in terms of your, target audiences, a-and bringing a, a genuine solution to overcoming challenges that are both felt not just by you, but also by the, event or, the, the rights holder that you're, sponsoring.

and, I think having a close partnership with, said indi-individual, whether it is a race, whether it is a rights holder or, whatever, the opportunity to get under the surface of, how can my, how can technology be a solution for you to, be better? and, I think that collective good is, one thing that, certainly has become a huge part of the partnerships that we do.

You think of the app many years ago, that, that wasn't part of m- many individuals', bingo cards. Now it's part of the furniture. if you don't have an app that's engaging your runners or your spectators or allowing people to move around a city, it's actually, frowned upon.

so I think,

Dan Beresh: trying to find- So tell me more about this. Sorry to interrupt you, George. Yeah. But I'm just really curious- Yeah ... about this, this partnership, because I think a lot of listeners probably won't know the extent to which, y- you're partnered with these folks, right?

From afar, especially for folks who are not runners, it may just look like, all right, we, we paid a bunch of money, and we put our logo on the marathon, and we're, we're so happy we did that. But it's, yet it's so much more than that, right? It's, it feels like a truly integrated partnership, if I can use those words.

Is that, right?

George Hutchins: Yeah, 100%. I'll give you perhaps a real-life example. coming out of the pandemic, a huge shift in sort of audience engagement and insights was, making events, more sustainable. And that came from the participants, the spectators themselves. a lot, big part, piece of work that was done.

And so for us, we were like, "Okay, how do we shift that into an opportunity? how do we find a solution through technology?" We did some pro bono work, and essentially, created a, a platform, labeled Rescore. and that enabled the race organize- or organizations to, effectively grade and mark how sustainable an event was.

it m- it enabled it- Huh ... to capture all of the insights, the outputs of a race, grade it, cri- critique it. W- alongside that, that Rescore platform, we part- partnered with, an organization called the Council for Responsible Sport. And then suddenly It, gave a, a, a certificate, a series of, criteria, levels, Evergreen being the, the, the top.

A- and now we're very proud to have, a number of those solutions that have now turned into certifications for these race organizations in a sustainable-- the, the problem being how do you make this more sustainable, 'cause I'm appealed by that. That's now become a business solution that we are able to use i- in the future, more broadly.

that's, maybe one of the examples that is probably quite relevant here, where you're trying to do better, trying to do, do good, ha- trying to understand what might be a problem for a race and then, provide a solution for it.

Dan Beresh: Yeah, you're not just trying to say, "Hey, we'll, we'll fund you.

We'll give you a little bit of, of ability to- to, work with liquid capital." It's more than that. it's, you're actually- Yeah ... helping them with the, the technology solutions that, that you create for other clients, on the daily. So it's just, seems to create mu- much more of an interesting story as well, I imagine, to tell, right?

Sure. And, do you leverage that, that story with your clients? what an incredible thing to say that you've not only got into this for i- an incredible reason because of your executives, but also now you're helping them with applications, you're helping them with, you know- Yeah ... making their, race greener.

George Hutchins: Yeah. that, that's obviously one case, and there are many others. we did some work with Des Linden. We created a digital heart with her. Digital twin is a huge topic and a huge, solution for our, clients. Actually, probably more so than maybe the, Rescore platform.

but sustainability is very big too. being able to tap into that digital twin technology which is so applicable to, to the business environment, that was another example. providing a marathon narrative with a real-life runner, creating a digital twin of her heart to understand for-- to enable her to understand more about, what she is doing, what she can do in her performance, but also applying it then to, the intersection of business and running.

it's almost like a, a real-life case study. but, maybe, Dan, one more thing to mention. I-I've s-spoken about community, but an example around, another thing which is maybe reinforces that community, the nod to community. a huge part of, ensuring that, those that participate, that those l-- want, those that want to live a healthier life, you know, is certainly for London, is the TCS Mini London Marathon, and engaging the children, inspiring them, being able to run on the same section of the, course as those, as those, those elites or those, those mass runners o-on the Sunday.

and, enabling them and their parents to get involved in a, one mile and a two point six kilometer race. we-we're looking at inspiring the next generation. It's not just, like you say, a one and done, "Here's a bit of money and, we'll see you in, four, five, six years," or whatever it might be.

It's really investing in ultimately, the future too. and that's an incredibly powerful, engagement piece for us which, come down and participate with your mum or dad, and have a fantastic day, get a medal, walk out, walk away inspired. It's a, lovely story too.

Dan Beresh: Yeah, an, an incredible experience, right?

But there's a, the, also the business side to all this. And- Yeah ... I imagine for our listeners, y- the, the, thing that people are gonna start to wonder here is, okay, George, and this is fantastic, you're doing this and, it could be purely philanthropic. But we know that there is- Yeah

a sponsorship element to it, there is a marketing element to it. Sure. There is a, a client engagement element to it, right? So you're doing all this incredible work, and what an incredible story and the fact that it's so beneficial. But I think what was so interesting, to me about this story is that it also carries the business benefit, right?

And, and- and you're doing so much to ensure that, what you come out with is also incredibly positive for TCS, right?

George Hutchins: For sure. For sure. And I think, one key word is, relationships, being able to, yes, you might build for, eight or nine months before a, the TCS London Marathon, but we've recently launched a, TCS Run Club.

we're looking at multiple touchpoints throughout the 12-month period that enables us to, help those individuals. they may not necessarily want to participate in a marathon, but, and that's, absolutely fine. but come down, get involved in a bit of a run club. perhaps, we've had the likes of Paula Radcliffe down, to inspire, again, that, that community and, hear from her, understand how, what it takes, the crossover between business resilience, like we've mentioned before.

And it's, it's goes back to, how, can you build, better relationships over the course of the year? yes, use running as, as an example of that. understand more about how, again, ask questions like, "What are the challenges that you're facing?" In, in a room with 50 or 60 other C-suite, guests, guarantee that, one or two of them have got the same or ha- or may experience the same sort of challenges, either then or, in the future.

so I think, yeah, coming back to that word of relationships, it's trying to get under the surface of, how, can, being there at the right time, yes, the marathon does a phenomenal job for that brand awareness piece. The logo's everywhere, sure. But, nothing beats that face-to-face, that engagement, that facilitating of, an experience and, talking in a very, less boardroom-like type scenario.

Dan Beresh: that's exactly it, isn't it, is everyone these days is kind of- leery, shall we say, around people trying to sell to them. Every time get a message on LinkedIn, get someone who adds you, it's like, "Oh my God, this person's just gonna, they're just gonna sell me some, lead gen. Give me, 100 leads and I'll promise you a million bucks- Yeah

in your business." But I think in, life, we are also conditioned in a business setting to be resistant to that. And yet, as businesses who work with other businesses, our goal is to, just help them do better in their own, you know- For sure ... in their own business. And so you have to find a way to get through to people, and what an incredible opportunity to really get someone, and not in any way of a bad way, but when someone's guard is, down, when they're not feeling like they're gonna be sold to and you're not selling, you're just, you're, to your point, you're just building that relationship.

You're building that trust. Yeah. and through such a, a positive activity that is so- Yeah ... green and so good for, your health and your mental health. what an incredible opportunity to actually connect with the human behind the that person who's sitting in the boardroom and might, might eventually be a customer.

George Hutchins: 100%. You look at some of the footprints that we have with, these races, they're in very enviable positions. certainly for London as an example, you're on the, you're on the Mall. you're, having a purpose-filled sh- built structure, which very much houses, kids on the Saturday.

Obviously, that will change next year with the, muse of the double. but, kids will move to the Friday. Saturday and Sunday will be hospitality days, and of course the, the, the mass races. but I think, maybe it's a little bit obvious, but you've got this purpose-filled built opportunity here, on the Mall, very great location.

In the last sort of 12 to, to 18 months, I've really worked with our leaders to, to say, guys, use this space. bring down, host meetings, engage with these, these C-suite, these key, key, key decision-makers. Understand-"

Dan Beresh: Yeah, get out of the boardroom.

Get out of the stuffy- 100% ... office. Get out of the- Yeah ... place you rented at your, your Vegas conference, your tiny windowless little room. get into some beautiful London location. Yeah. Like what could be better, right?

George Hutchins: Ex- exactly. Exactly. so that's a big-- That's been a big shift as well.

for sure, I wouldn't probably advise speaking to someone post-marathon. but, but yeah.

Dan Beresh: That's when you sell them, right? That's when you say, "Hey, by the way, there's a $50 million deal. I got this contract," and there, you know- Should I sign here? No, I, wouldn't, recommend that either. but, but, but a marathon, I've run a few marathons, and I think one thing that it does is it, really challenges you physically so much that you get to the point where you are just at-- You're, the very limit of your kind of human ability, and so you are just, the human.

you have to shed all of the sort of business and everything else that you're thinking about because- getting over that line is so difficult, Yeah ... that you just-- I, I feel like you, you create this ability to interact with just with the person as a person, and we don't have to have these, niceties or, those things that come around, b- the standard business, Yeah

conversation, right? It's just- Yeah. 100% ... let's, let me connect with you directly.

George Hutchins: Yeah, 100%. And, maybe going back to that point on, on the run clubs as well, people are washed out, like you say. It's a, it's an incredible feat to do. But to have those moments where you can engage, I'm sure every business' calendar is, full, up with, events, with engagements, with certain, sectors, throughout the year.

but to be able to culminate in a, a, 12-month period in, a couple of run clubs, and, and then end, end with the, main prize and, hopefully change people's habits or, whatever. There's, a huge, there's a huge, positive, to that.

Dan Beresh: What's been the executives' response to your saying, "Hey, instead of having a meeting in the office, ha- come have a meeting in the sponsorship space that we've put together"?

George Hutchins: Haven't had anyone say no yet. it's, been, widely received, very well. w- we often won't also look at it as a, host a meeting, but just, we'll set up a space, ha- have a discussion, whether that be five, 10 minutes, understand a bit more.

again, we wanna keep it informal. if that, that individual is, with their child or their partner, either on Saturday or the Sunday, they probably just wanna have a discussion. that can be, it doesn't have to be secretive, confidential. it can back-- There's so much noise going on, so much positive energy.

You can have that wherever you are. But, we're, very fortunate we have a, number of contractual rights too that we get the opportunity to leverage. and, the opportunity to, provide clients with, the f- the flag off for the TCS Mini London Marathon to start the races for the, kids.

again, that's just a, a lovely opportunity to, engage with and go beyond, especially if their child is in that race. it's a wonderful moment. yeah, haven't had anyone say no. long may that continue, but, but yeah.

Dan Beresh: How do you take advantage of these experiences that you are afforded by virtue of sponsoring an event like the marathon?

if, if another marketer is looking at a huge sponsorship and, they're, gonna have a number of these experiences, what, has been the best, some of the best things that you feel you've done in, in, in order to get the best possible business value out of that?

George Hutchins: Oh gosh, that's a tricky question, Dan.

It's a, o- one to, really unpack. But-

Dan Beresh: it's tough, right? That's, what we're all here for is if you could-- If we all knew the perfect right answer, then we, would be out of a job, right?

George Hutchins: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I think there's probably multiple elements to it. we're obviously in the B2B space.

we're predominantly-- Certainly if you look at the EXL, the running show where people collect their bibs, that's very much a B2C place, an environment. But you are-- Or you, may have runners that are there in their B2C or their consumer mindsets, but, but they might be Monday to Friday, they might be in the IT or consultancy or tech space, or might be looking for the next solution.

so it's important how we show up and, maybe to-- back to your question, you know- a lot of talk is, often shared around, you pay for a rights fee and, a number of people think, that's it. Great. Now, go and-- now get on with it." But actually having activation funds to go with that, to actually maximize the engagement that you have.

and there'll be different pockets, right? You'll, the, the B2B side is the hospitality angle to it historically, certainly on the weekend. But the B2C side, bringing your brand to life, making sure that people are, taking a, a takeaway from the experience that you're bringing and the stand that you have.

especially now that we've, pivoted to, to the AI environment being, one of-- wanting to be the largest AI, business, you know, globally, or AI services company globally. that means that we've had to think harder about how we pitch up in the B2C environment, because, a B2B sta- a stall, stand, expo is very different to a B2C environment.

I think the activation funds is probably a quite crucial one, making sure that's part of it. There's some, sensible ways that you can go about that. Sometimes, I've heard recently of folks baking into some of those rights fees, some contractual spends in activation to, enable them to, to, to do a few things, which I think is a, a nuance which, means that you don't have to go back to your CFO requesting for, more, funds.

but yeah, probably there's, multiple ways to, to, to, skin a cat. but that's probably some of the, ones that we've had a lot of joy, going down and, discussing with our leadership.

Dan Beresh: So you talk about this B2C mindset. Obviously, as a B2B organization, you want people ultimately to be thinking about your brand, and if they need, AI services, if they need a transformation, then TCS is gonna be the, per- the, the company that they come to, right?

Is it really that stark? is it, "Okay, I'm showing up at the marathon, I'm, in a B2C mindset," and is it then your job to, to put that person in a B2B mindset or at least make them think, "Hey, you know what? There's this great consultancy organization that's sponsoring this event, and I also tend to work in this environment"?

Or i- is it more around ensuring that people who are prospective or, existing clients, get that hospitality experience and get those unique moments that they can share, with their children and their families? what's most important to you, or how do you weigh all of the potential-- You mean there are infinite potentials of, types of activation that you could h- that you could do.

Yes. Where do you decide to put your money?

George Hutchins: Yeah. Yeah, spot on, Dan. It's, the, the key focus is, coming back to that word of access, by nature of these marathons that have now become so, so big, the demand is so high, having access to these is the first step, right? and we've got lucky in that, regard.

Being able to provide these, th-these clients, these stakeholders, employees, these, these-- the key folks in the community, with a spot to run, that's a huge proposition and, an op- an, an opportunity that we don't take lightly, because like you said, the, the reward post finish line is just amazing.

of course, the focus is predominantly in, ensuring that their experience is, that of, a key one. There's a lot of work that goes behind, individuals that, that will extend invitations. we sadly have a pretty long list, so it makes it quite difficult. we'd love to have more, but, but, that, that's probably the, the big focus.

I think, maybe to lean into a, a study that we, recently partnered with, Brand Finance on, that launch last year around looking at the sort of the world's biggest marathons globally. I think it was the top 50 that came out. if you look in the running space, TCS within a running world environment is recognized by 46% of those that, that, that run- Wow

and, participate. Whereas if, you don't, and they don't, that, that number drops down to a whopping 16% or something around that sort of, at least around a 20% mark. Huh. whilst all the elements around brand awareness, the signage, logos, you know, how we turn up, and how we involve and engage with PR, with media, with those that we're hosting, that's of course very important.

We d- you know, we, make sure, my team makes sures that, we are still leveraging those opportunities. But it is really about the, coming back to that relationship angle. It is ensuring that their experience is that of an incredibly high premium standard, and that's something across our events more broadly, actually, that we really, don't take lightly.

if you come and j- join a TCS event, it's to a very high caliber. a-and that, that, comes across in our sponsorships that we deliver. a-and ultimately, we want to make what is an already incredibly rewarding experience for someone that doesn't run, that even bit better. So, yeah, that's a huge part of it, for sure.

Dan Beresh: Yeah, really creating that association with that incredible moment, that incredible joy, and, also, the experience that you're able to provide certainly gives you that, that positive, that, and- For sure ... the other really interesting thing is just how difficult these marathons can be to get into, right?

A lot of them- Yeah ... if folks who are listening are not runners, a lot of them are now a lottery system, and, you just hope to get in, and, and people come from around the world and, will just wait and wait and okay, I got a spot, I'm booking a flight. I don't know if any of my friends got in.

I don't know if I'm gonna know anyone there. So the ability to guarantee someone a spot at some of these events must be just, as you say, absolutely invaluable, to people, and to be really part of that, that incredible moment, must do absolute, wonders for, the relationships that you're trying to build.

George Hutchins: 100%. Yeah, there's probably nothing more to say than, yeah, we're very fortunate to be in that space. So that's, something that we don't take lightly and, try and make every, every moment that we can engage with, said individual that extra special. it certainly goes a long way.

Dan Beresh: So George, I just wanna pull us back out of the- Yeah

the marathon lens for, or the last little bit here, and I'm, just because i, imagine, not everyone who's listening to this podcast is gonna necessarily sponsor a marathon. But when it comes to sponsorship in general, obviously you've done an incredible job, at, really making these events phenomenal for both your clients and for the general public.

what an incredible experience for, for the brand as well, just to get in front of so many thousands of people. But you must along the way have seen some things, have avoided some issues, maybe even had issues yourselves, that, you know, you'd say, "Geez, if, we were about to sponsor a big event, this is something that I would really recommend that someone else, avoid or make sure they do."

So what do you think? Like what are those kind of pitfalls? What are those things that you need to, watch out for? What are those gotchas when it comes to a big company thinking about starting to sponsor a, big brand or a big event?

George Hutchins: Yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot you said about the data, and the insights, not just slapping a logo somewhere.

understanding the insights and the data, and I think there's a lot of people that will reach out and say, "I think your brand will be an amazing, amazing partnership," of course. And a lot of cold calling, a lot of emails, a lot of LinkedIn requests, all that sort of stuff. I think the, genuine, value that a potential brand can bring to tapping into more audiences or, like I said before, the solutions that TCS might be able to provide that are relevant for both the business and also spectators, runners.

that's, I think, where you can suddenly bring genuine value. I think getting under the surface of working with the right sort of, a-an event or, whatever it might be and saying, "Look, how can we help you? How can our data help you achieve X or Y?" and a lot of times it's, people think, "Oh-" the deck has to be absolutely incredible first time around, has to have all the right things, and then suddenly I might engage with you.

what's there to be said to have a few discussions and understand, what are your challenges? What-- how might our brand help you? a-and have some genuine conversations 'cause I think maybe coming back to the genuine angle of, all of this is, if you're gonna bring genuine value, that's gonna bring, genuine, authentic res-- resonation with, your brand audience, the event, different audiences tapping into, to a younger generation, to an older generation.

Whatever your objectives might be, I think that, that genuine value, ultimately enables both of you to do well. You ultimately both want to exceed. You don't wanna be a, a turn up for one day, pay X amount of money, and see you in two years. It's, a, hopefully a, longevity is the, key word here.

Dan Beresh: Yeah, and there must be compounding value for you if you have a longer sponsorship, right? People start to recognize that this is the TCS Marathon, and that name starts to stick after, after a period of time. The expectation around you having this wonderful hospitality and event every year, I imagine is way more valuable once clients know and love it as opposed to s- the first year where y- I imagine you're just, you're getting into it and learning what you can do y-y-yourself, right?

George Hutchins: Yeah. look, I think, yeah, w- Sebastian and, So- Soe and Kipchoge breaking two hours certainly helps your, brand, awareness globally. It doesn't hurt. It certainly doesn't hurt. but yeah, it-- to your point, having a very varied portfolio of assets, enables you to target different areas, right?

And, sometimes it's the moments like, that finishing tape that of course, if you took a step back, of course that's gonna at some point be a huge, piece of real estate for you. But, but yeah, when these amazing athletes through the use of technology, through the use of, how advanced things have gotten, to be able to associate your brand with, these moments, is, incredibly powerful, I think.

and, obviously Adidas did a tremendous job with, some of the stuff that they launched, post-race with Sebastian. there's now adverts across the globe with the TCS, you know, finish tape, on in different countries. that, that does the brand, awareness a, a world of good.

and that, and those things are, we don't-- haven't s-set out to come into these partnerships and go, "God, I can't wait for that first person to finish, in under two hours." it's, all the other elements that sort of h- add up to the overall value that, running or pa-partnering with- with endurance races has, has seen TCS be fortunate.

but also, maybe coming back to the strategic angle to it, it wasn't just a, a health decision all those years ago. we've now worked hard to, to make it a strat- strategic acce- success, and lean into some of those real-life examples of, adding value.

Dan Beresh: One of the things I heard you say, and correct me i- if this is not exactly what you're, what you meant, but what I took from it was, yes, you're doing all this stuff, yes, you're being so successful, yes, you've had all this incredible value.

At the, the same time, this has been built over years, and I imagine for the marketer who's just getting into this, type of sponsorship for the first year or two, huge amount of pressure to deliver value. Am I right in, in, reading between the lines what you're saying and also saying that it's iterative?

Every year is going to be a little bit better, and, is it fair to say, I j- don't, put all of that pressure on yourself to deliver all of these incredible things in the very first year of your sponsorship, right? It's, about building that relationship like you would, with a, new client and, doing more and getting deeper and deeper every year, as opposed to keeping things sort of surface level.

It's about having that commitment. It's about having those shared values. It's about having those shared ambitions, and ultimately growing together and growing the relationship and the sponsorship together, rather than feeling like the minute you get in, it has to be, perfect and, in, in every single way.

George Hutchins: Dan, you're absolutely spot on. And there's so many examples of that across the portfolio that have actually been so true to that. and in fact, one, one, two of, two of my leaders, Ashish Babu, CMO for major markets in all, the geographies and our, global CMO, Abhinav Kumar, tremendous advocates for, no one is expecting, a Clark Animo in the Philippines or, a, a s- a, a smaller race, Paris as an example, a Schneider Electric, Marathon du Paris to, overnight after signing a contract to be on par with a New York or a London.

and I think probably the TCS Sydney Marathon is an example of that, where, they have grown exponentially. They've got-- They went from 5,000 runners to 15,000 runners to 35,000 runners in three years. Wow. Now, you think of the, the runner experience- In three years. In three years. and you think of the runner experience in that, right?

Operationally, that's a massive- Yeah ... massive pain point or, a, challenging hurdle to overcome. It's a

Dan Beresh: huge risk. Just- It could be an absolute disaster to, you know-- Right? If you didn't-

George Hutchins: Massive ...

Dan Beresh: plan for that, it could be-

George Hutchins: they obviously have planned for it, don't get me wrong. But operationally, that's a big pressure on the team to ensure that the experience is that of the same.

And to be fair, that's a huge feather- Yeah ... in their cap to go from that growth. you could argue that the likes of London, the New Yorks, have helped Wayne, the, the race director of Pont 3, of the TCS Sydney Marathon. they've helped it. they've, they've-- Coming back to that area of, finding those shared values, a lot of the race organizers do that.

They, help one another be more successful. a- and we certainly did that. we've hosted a number of actually other sponsors, in our hospitality, in our, what we call the clubhouse, the, at the finishing line, to answer some questions, to understand, okay, how did it start out?

What did you build from? Make sure, coming back to that Ashish and, Abhinav comment about, my CMOs It was very much what is achievable? Don't set your goals too high because the-- once the platform's built and then build from there and scale, it, one, it also blows the, the experience part of a client, year on year, they see improvements.

and, ultimately, you've-- we're lucky that we have a number of different partnerships that we can call upon that, that do provide a bit of a benchmark. You could argue that perhaps TCS New York and New York City Marathon and TCS London Marathon are those sort of shining lights. but other teams then come into town, and understand, pick up learnings.

I was fortunate to go out to, the TCS Sydney Marathon last year, help their team also, shape and, ask the right sort of questions and, engage with the race organizers to, benefit, those that they were engaging with. And I think that's what it's all about. it's sharing those insights.

but dip your toe in the water. Coming back to your question, give it a go. I would certainly encourage other sponsors that are in that space, whether it's a, a football club, whether it's a, a, a, major tournament, reach out to your peers and, ask them, can I get some learnings?

Can I grab half an hour? Can I understand what some of your challenges are? Because, coming back to that sort of TCS Run Club solution and problem that we, had, that we spoke about earlier You know, nine times out of 10, these C-suite guys are probably having the same problems. I can probably tell you that we're gonna face the same challenges that another sponsor or brand might face too, and if we can share those, those insights, God, it makes for a better, environment, better space to be in.

Dan Beresh: couldn't agree more, and, exactly why we, host this podcast is to try to create an environment where we can share these incredible- Of course ... learnings. And George, what a great moment to, wrap up there in terms of just, thinking about, the, incredible success you've had here, and, and how it's, really built and built over time and, gotten to the point where you now have this incredible library.

So I think it's great advice as well is I, really fundamentally believe, we're all in this together. we're all just trying to do the best we can. If we all knew how to do sponsorships perfectly, there'd be no sponsorship positions available because the, the best practice- 100% ... would just be out there and you'd just do it.

But there is no perfect right way to do it, and that's actually, I think, what's brilliant about marketing and what's so much fun about it. And so- it has been so much fun to, to chat with you today and to just get some of your insights and to learn a little bit more about, what's going on behind the curtain of this incredible, sponsorship vehicle that, that you're helping to drive.

George, did you have anything else? Is, there anything else you didn't get a chance to say? Anything else you wanna leave the audience with in terms of advice around these, these big sponsorships and how to make them successful?

George Hutchins: a lot could be said about, having the right leadership as well that, that support these, these, these opportunities.

at TCS, we're very lucky to have, very passionate leaders, in the sp- in the space that, really do back and, see the value that, that that it brings. And to your point, Dan- It's not about getting it 100% right. y- with data, you can shape it the way you want.

But ultimately, if you don't get out there and actually experience it for yourself and give it a go, it can be a very powerful platform, for you to engage with. and, the, the leaders that we have, we're very fortunate that they, get fully behind it. Yeah, we spoke about running, but, Jaguar TCS Racing is another example of that.

but no, maybe just to open myself up to anyone that did, did wanna, grab a coffee or, have a Teams call and, probe or ask any questions, I- I'm more than welcome to, to have that. and, yeah. Yeah, how

Dan Beresh: should people reach out to you?

George Hutchins: probably LinkedIn's the best.

maybe don't start with a 50-page slide deck, saying how your brand could spon- you know, TCS could value with that. Are

Dan Beresh: you, are, you saying you don't want people to reach out on LinkedIn and, pitch you on, lead gen and, a- and, just absolute pitch slap you? I mean-

George Hutchins: There is always time for that, but, yeah.

I'm sure you've never heard that before, D- Dan. But, no, listen, I would be, I'd be a bit of a hypocrite if I, didn't encourage th- those to, ask questions, to engage. get involved in, in, in coming down to a marathon, see one for yourself. it's a tr- it's a m- tremendous environment to be in, and everyone's got their own story, which is incredibly powerful.

yeah, I really appreciate you having me, Dan, and those that are listening, very grateful for your time.

Dan Beresh: George, thank you again for participating. I, have had just a wonderful conversation today and learned so much about, sponsorships, what to do, what not to do. Folks, this has been the Fide Podcast.

I'm Dan Beresh. I'm the founder of Fide B2B Marketing. And, thanks very much for listening. We'll see you next time.